Comments on: Post-Action Dissonance http://blog.jimnovo.com/2009/07/10/post-action-dissonance/ Moving from a Low Accountability to a High Accountability Business Model Sun, 7 Mar 2010 12:47:21 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: Twitter Trackbacks for Post-Action Dissonance » Marketing Productivity Blog » Blog Archive [jimnovo.com] on Topsy.com http://blog.jimnovo.com/2009/07/10/post-action-dissonance/comment-page-1/#comment-76136 Twitter Trackbacks for Post-Action Dissonance » Marketing Productivity Blog » Blog Archive [jimnovo.com] on Topsy.com Sun, 30 Aug 2009 09:10:01 +0000 http://blog.jimnovo.com/?p=311#comment-76136 [...] Post-Action Dissonance » Marketing Productivity Blog » Blog Archive blog.jimnovo.com/2009/07/10/post-action-dissonance – view page – cached Moving from a Low Accountability to a High Accountability Business Model — From the page [...] [...] Post-Action Dissonance » Marketing Productivity Blog » Blog Archive blog.jimnovo.com/2009/07/10/post-action-dissonance – view page – cached Moving from a Low Accountability to a High Accountability Business Model — From the page [...]

]]> By: Dissonant Noise http://blog.jimnovo.com/2009/07/10/post-action-dissonance/comment-page-1/#comment-74187 Dissonant Noise Fri, 31 Jul 2009 15:44:18 +0000 http://blog.jimnovo.com/?p=311#comment-74187 [...] you don't subscribe to Jim yet, you [...] [...] you don’t subscribe to Jim yet, you [...]

]]> By: Jim Novo http://blog.jimnovo.com/2009/07/10/post-action-dissonance/comment-page-1/#comment-72833 Jim Novo Sat, 11 Jul 2009 18:14:45 +0000 http://blog.jimnovo.com/?p=311#comment-72833 Here's what's interesting to me. If you look at a journal like Marketing Science, about 1/3 to 1/2 of the articles are about the web, and by definition, all of them involve web analytics in some way. NONE of these academics are "web analysts" as commonly defined, yet they are putting out work that absolutely blows away anything you have ever seen out of a web analyst. These folks are light years ahead of what most people talk about. This, even though the journal crowd follows the SAME scientifc method for testing that web analysts use. The biggest difference? The journal crowd doesn't ignore history. In fact, the very nature of their work *requires* them to drag in citations of previous papers in Marketing, as well as from all of the other social sciences, so they are always building on what has been proven before. That's why they are so far ahead of the "industry", which tends to view absolutely every Marketing "best practice" as a new discovery, when most of the time it's just a rehash of what somebody discovered (and documented) 10, 20, 50 years ago. The big difference on the journal side is the web provides tons of behavioral data nobody had access to before. They're building whole new models of human behavior. In fact, I bet for every question the social blogosphere continues to examine it's collective navel on a proof has been *already published* on the academic side. How do we know what we know, indeed. Here’s what’s interesting to me.

If you look at a journal like Marketing Science, about 1/3 to 1/2 of the articles are about the web, and by definition, all of them involve web analytics in some way. NONE of these academics are “web analysts” as commonly defined, yet they are putting out work that absolutely blows away anything you have ever seen out of a web analyst. These folks are light years ahead of what most people talk about.

This, even though the journal crowd follows the SAME scientifc method for testing that web analysts use. The biggest difference?

The journal crowd doesn’t ignore history.

In fact, the very nature of their work *requires* them to drag in citations of previous papers in Marketing, as well as from all of the other social sciences, so they are always building on what has been proven before.

That’s why they are so far ahead of the “industry”, which tends to view absolutely every Marketing “best practice” as a new discovery, when most of the time it’s just a rehash of what somebody discovered (and documented) 10, 20, 50 years ago.

The big difference on the journal side is the web provides tons of behavioral data nobody had access to before. They’re building whole new models of human behavior.

In fact, I bet for every question the social blogosphere continues to examine it’s collective navel on a proof has been *already published* on the academic side.

How do we know what we know, indeed.

]]> By: Jacques Warren http://blog.jimnovo.com/2009/07/10/post-action-dissonance/comment-page-1/#comment-72828 Jacques Warren Sat, 11 Jul 2009 16:00:51 +0000 http://blog.jimnovo.com/?p=311#comment-72828 Well, Jim, you're right. Web Analytics do not exist yet as a discipline, I believe, because its paradigm, methodologies, in short, its entire epistemological framework hasn't been established yet. But one can ask the question if WA could do it by itself, and come up with new, hard evidence that would add to the corpus of knowledge of the behavioral sciences. I believe that if we seriously started borrowing heavily from the soft sciences (Namely Psycho / Socio as you point out), WA could realize an important jump that would bring us further than the world of opinions we live in (blogosphere, etc). We could start with much more evidence (i.e *data*) based research before we start pontificating... Well, Jim, you’re right. Web Analytics do not exist yet as a discipline, I believe, because its paradigm, methodologies, in short, its entire epistemological framework hasn’t been established yet. But one can ask the question if WA could do it by itself, and come up with new, hard evidence that would add to the corpus of knowledge of the behavioral sciences.

I believe that if we seriously started borrowing heavily from the soft sciences (Namely Psycho / Socio as you point out), WA could realize an important jump that would bring us further than the world of opinions we live in (blogosphere, etc).

We could start with much more evidence (i.e *data*) based research before we start pontificating…

]]> By: Jim Novo http://blog.jimnovo.com/2009/07/10/post-action-dissonance/comment-page-1/#comment-72824 Jim Novo Sat, 11 Jul 2009 14:56:23 +0000 http://blog.jimnovo.com/?p=311#comment-72824 Hey wait a minute, is there a pattern here? Chris Grant, Bryan Eisenberg, Jim Novo, Jacques Warren all have backgrounds that include the study of Psychology / Sociology. Hmmm... Any other readers who stumbled into analytics from the soft sciences? Do you think it's possible analysts might pick up an edge from the study of human and societal behavior? Chris, I bet you're using your Psych major subconsciously... Hey wait a minute, is there a pattern here?

Chris Grant, Bryan Eisenberg, Jim Novo, Jacques Warren all have backgrounds that include the study of Psychology / Sociology. Hmmm…

Any other readers who stumbled into analytics from the soft sciences?

Do you think it’s possible analysts might pick up an edge from the study of human and societal behavior?

Chris, I bet you’re using your Psych major subconsciously…

]]> By: Chris Grant http://blog.jimnovo.com/2009/07/10/post-action-dissonance/comment-page-1/#comment-72791 Chris Grant Sat, 11 Jul 2009 03:09:12 +0000 http://blog.jimnovo.com/?p=311#comment-72791 Hah, I love this. Cognitive Dissonance is one of too few usable things to come out of psychology (disillusioned psych major speaking here). I'd like to see more talk like this. Hah, I love this. Cognitive Dissonance is one of too few usable things to come out of psychology (disillusioned psych major speaking here). I’d like to see more talk like this.

]]> By: Jacques Warren http://blog.jimnovo.com/2009/07/10/post-action-dissonance/comment-page-1/#comment-72761 Jacques Warren Fri, 10 Jul 2009 18:31:11 +0000 http://blog.jimnovo.com/?p=311#comment-72761 Your post reminds us that, at its very root, "interactive" means "relational", and that humans relations are ingrained in very basic social (and their psychological reflections) realities such as exchange and reciprocity (gift giving, marital structures, trade, etc). I give you a cow, you give me a chicken. Imbalance in social exchange, reflected in powerful emotions of being insulted, cheated, dissonance, etc. You could have known well before, since you were in the same social exchange system, that you would piss me off by giving me a chicken for my cow. Applying this metaphor to Web marketing, one can see how risky the whole proposition can be if one does not take into acount the Post-Action Dissonance phenomenon you describe: decrease in profits (increased support costs), disengagement, disloyalty, etc. Your post reminds us that, at its very root, “interactive” means “relational”, and that humans relations are ingrained in very basic social (and their psychological reflections) realities such as exchange and reciprocity (gift giving, marital structures, trade, etc).

I give you a cow, you give me a chicken. Imbalance in social exchange, reflected in powerful emotions of being insulted, cheated, dissonance, etc. You could have known well before, since you were in the same social exchange system, that you would piss me off by giving me a chicken for my cow.

Applying this metaphor to Web marketing, one can see how risky the whole proposition can be if one does not take into acount the Post-Action Dissonance phenomenon you describe: decrease in profits (increased support costs), disengagement, disloyalty, etc.

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