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	<title>Comments on: Online Marketing Bands</title>
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	<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2008/06/06/online-marketing-bands/</link>
	<description>Moving from a Low Accountability to a High Accountability Business Model</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 09:01:56 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Jim Novo</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2008/06/06/online-marketing-bands/#comment-27312</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Novo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 23:31:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/?p=224#comment-27312</guid>
		<description>Steve, I'm sure you would agree there is no "right" way to Optimize Marketing Systems; depends on the biz model.

What is important for every business model is to step through the scenarios as you have done above, understand which activities might create value and which probably will not, test some things, and then allocate resources to the highest and best use.

That's all anyone could possibly expect.

The challenge is, so few managers demand this kind of Marketing Productivity thinking in the first place, and as a result a lot of precious resources get wasted.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve, I&#8217;m sure you would agree there is no &#8220;right&#8221; way to Optimize Marketing Systems; depends on the biz model.</p>
<p>What is important for every business model is to step through the scenarios as you have done above, understand which activities might create value and which probably will not, test some things, and then allocate resources to the highest and best use.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s all anyone could possibly expect.</p>
<p>The challenge is, so few managers demand this kind of Marketing Productivity thinking in the first place, and as a result a lot of precious resources get wasted.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2008/06/06/online-marketing-bands/#comment-27232</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 03:11:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/?p=224#comment-27232</guid>
		<description>Heh. HUGE thanks Jim. So much to think about, which is why it's taken me a week to respond. :-)

Keeping in mind this is coming from a Government perspective. So we're not trying to monetise visitors per-se, that's what Tax Departments are for. ;-) Having said that we do *try* and model our costs on a per success/person, to gain a measure of ... justification? efficiency? down that path.

Good point on the Band 1. We do get references in *consumer* magazines, TV and the like. It does happen, but is rarer in the professional side. I'd forgotten about those. However, similar to recent answer of yours - that _seems_ to be more general PR. I've found only very weak correlations to upticks in immediate traffic. Longer Term? Who knows... but we feel it adds value.

And yes we do hand loot out at the various conferences and the like. But given you imply the goal of that loot (pens etc) being to gain secondary(?) attention from the end consumers, perhaps we should think some more on just what/how we do that. Hmmmmm x 3.

Blogs? Just doesn't happen. I've only ever come across one blog posting from a consumer that references our site. People don't habitually blog about personal medical issues ... in my experience. :-D

Could we facilitate this better? Probably - gets back to budget and resources mostly. The truly frustrating part for me personally, is that we're phenomenally successful without any real effort. And only squeaky wheels get oiled in govvie land. That we could do so much better is seen more as a ... reserve when the growth finally drops off. :-( /cynical

We've examined the tell-a-friend concept several times. It comes up for re-examination fairly often. But it does have some seriously major negatives which tend to offset any positives it could drive. Not least being that such a facility is incredibly prone to abuse - in and of itself no so much, but coupled with the type of information we carry - oh yeah. We've had nasty incidents in the past with trivial incorrect email addresses and feedback. Tell-A-Friend would be oh so much worse.
Scenario Example: Teenagers. Someone has a bad case of Acne. So one of their... "friends" sends them a link to our acne page. Very not nice.
Possibly we could wrap sufficing words around any such sending....

As for retention?
These are anonymous visitors for the most part. The userid/login side is badly done - we know that - just haven't been able to resource fixing/improving. Which if done, would massively solve that issue.
Our research has indicated that most people (consumers vs medicos) use the site when they need it. And then not again till they next need it. Which can be 6-12 months. Our visitor analysis has tended to bear this out as well. 


But thanks again for the suggestions and thoughts. Definitely stuff to follow up!

Cheers!
- Steve</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Heh. HUGE thanks Jim. So much to think about, which is why it&#8217;s taken me a week to respond. :-)</p>
<p>Keeping in mind this is coming from a Government perspective. So we&#8217;re not trying to monetise visitors per-se, that&#8217;s what Tax Departments are for. ;-) Having said that we do *try* and model our costs on a per success/person, to gain a measure of &#8230; justification? efficiency? down that path.</p>
<p>Good point on the Band 1. We do get references in *consumer* magazines, TV and the like. It does happen, but is rarer in the professional side. I&#8217;d forgotten about those. However, similar to recent answer of yours - that _seems_ to be more general PR. I&#8217;ve found only very weak correlations to upticks in immediate traffic. Longer Term? Who knows&#8230; but we feel it adds value.</p>
<p>And yes we do hand loot out at the various conferences and the like. But given you imply the goal of that loot (pens etc) being to gain secondary(?) attention from the end consumers, perhaps we should think some more on just what/how we do that. Hmmmmm x 3.</p>
<p>Blogs? Just doesn&#8217;t happen. I&#8217;ve only ever come across one blog posting from a consumer that references our site. People don&#8217;t habitually blog about personal medical issues &#8230; in my experience. :-D</p>
<p>Could we facilitate this better? Probably - gets back to budget and resources mostly. The truly frustrating part for me personally, is that we&#8217;re phenomenally successful without any real effort. And only squeaky wheels get oiled in govvie land. That we could do so much better is seen more as a &#8230; reserve when the growth finally drops off. :-( /cynical</p>
<p>We&#8217;ve examined the tell-a-friend concept several times. It comes up for re-examination fairly often. But it does have some seriously major negatives which tend to offset any positives it could drive. Not least being that such a facility is incredibly prone to abuse - in and of itself no so much, but coupled with the type of information we carry - oh yeah. We&#8217;ve had nasty incidents in the past with trivial incorrect email addresses and feedback. Tell-A-Friend would be oh so much worse.<br />
Scenario Example: Teenagers. Someone has a bad case of Acne. So one of their&#8230; &#8220;friends&#8221; sends them a link to our acne page. Very not nice.<br />
Possibly we could wrap sufficing words around any such sending&#8230;.</p>
<p>As for retention?<br />
These are anonymous visitors for the most part. The userid/login side is badly done - we know that - just haven&#8217;t been able to resource fixing/improving. Which if done, would massively solve that issue.<br />
Our research has indicated that most people (consumers vs medicos) use the site when they need it. And then not again till they next need it. Which can be 6-12 months. Our visitor analysis has tended to bear this out as well. </p>
<p>But thanks again for the suggestions and thoughts. Definitely stuff to follow up!</p>
<p>Cheers!<br />
- Steve</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Novo</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2008/06/06/online-marketing-bands/#comment-26628</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Novo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Jun 2008 17:24:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/?p=224#comment-26628</guid>
		<description>Well sure, it makes sense.

The interesting thing about working with so many technology folks is how differently they tend to approach problem solving than most Marketing folks - that's why I really like to have these ideas "spoken back to me" from the tech brain perspective.

The model is a Process - which I think is a way of understanding the world many tech folks can appreciate.  The Band model reflects a way of thinking about Marketing that's different from the usual offline approach (Push) that many onliners mimic.  The more appropriate model for &lt;strong&gt;interactive relationships&lt;/strong&gt; is that audiences are in "stages" and communicating to each stage uniquely (Pull) creates a truly optimized Marketing system.

In the Bands model, we take the Behavioral psych model AIDAS - Attention, Interest, Desire, Action, Satisfaction - and translate that into an Action plan.  The Top 2 Bands are addressing Attention, Interest, Desire.  Band 3 is Action.  Band 4 is Satisfaction, and to the extent there is a need for ongoing Satisfaction, you're dealing with Bands 5 - 8.  Ultimately, the model is a progressive, proactive plan of Value Creation / Conservation for the business.

Not all biz models, as you pointed out, need to address all 8 Bands, though I think if you really tear the biz model apart from a Marketing perspective, you’ll find more need for the lower Bands than you think.

So, your biz model relies heavily on the "Distribution" Band 2 - the GP's and Nurses.  That's where you focus your Attention, Interest, Desire activities – the conference and partner web sites.  

I’d find it hard to believe nothing happens in Band 1 – no articles or mentions in medical trade magazines?  No professional chat board or social media references to the site?  And if not, then why not?  Given zero budget for general Attention, shouldn’t there be some kind of effort on the PR side to get these Attention vehicles moving for you?  

Band 3 is the Action taken by the Targets of Bands 1 and 2 – the web site referral to the end patient.  In this role, the GP or Nurse is actually the “Landing Page” for the end consumer, because Band 4 is the actual visit by the patient to the web site – the end payoff or conversion.  

What could you do from a Marketing perspective to influence, facilitate, or “optimize” the human Landing Page that is this medical professional?  Are there downloads or other props (pens?  magnets?  sticky pads?) that could be supplied to the professionals which would facilitate / solidify the handoff from the referral to the actual site visit?  

In other words, can the Navigation of this Human Landing Page be further Optimized for the end consumer?

The desired Satisfaction taking place in Band 4, as you point out, simply is what it is.  And assuming the content is what was expected, the Visitor enters Band 5 with Satisfaction, and hopefully a newsletter subscription as part of the Band 4 Action.  The newsletter, as you point out, is the primary Retention device and to the extent the customer never needs to return, the LifeCycle is over, you have Defection and final LifeTime Value.

Unless you run ads in the newsletter, of course...:O

Now, I’m not sure where the money is in your biz model, which is critical to understand in terms of activity for each Band.  But I’ll go out on a limb and suggest it’s a bit cavalier to at that point go with “we don’t really want people to hang around” and leave it at that.  

My first question would be, what happens to the Value you just created in that Visitor?  Because ultimately the whole Band model is about progressive Value Creation, so what happens to the value of the Satisfaction that has been created in Band 5?  Does it just vanish, like snuffing out a flame?  Or is there a notion that Satisfaction can be Conserved, that the positive Momentum created in the Visitor could be passed along to the next Band?  Is it too early to let that Satisfaction simply dissipate?

For example, isn’t there some kind of tell-a-friend or other take away the Consumer could engage in to pass their Band 5 Satisfaction to other people as a Band 6 Retention of the Value Created?  

Or can you facilitate passing this Satisfaction back to the medical professional in a Band 3 kind of activity, the office visit?  To a professional, who upon receiving this Satisfaction, would be more likely to recommend the site to yet even more patients in Band 3?  

Or, can this Satisfaction be Retained in a Band 1 activity, where in a social setting of some kind, the end consumer expresses this Satisfaction to an audience?  Could you drive this social activity through the newsletter, for example?

In terms of the model, the above would be a ReActivation or Re-Engagement.  The only difference is instead of the Satisfaction being Conserved in the same person, it is passed along and Conserved in a different person, audience, or media.  A Transfer.

This is why there are so many Bands down in the Satisfaction / Retention area of the model.  On first thought, perhaps it doesn’t seem like there is much to do down there for some business models.  But before rejecting these Bands as having no ability to create Value, I think one needs to think deeply about the Marketing implications of the Business Model for each Band, and then step through potential Band Scenarios.

Maybe you do all the things I mentioned above, but simply have not thought of them in the context of the Bands, so have not realized the potential power of putting resources against truly Optimizing them.  Or perhaps you have.

Either way, I hope that’s the kind of thinking this model will encourage!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well sure, it makes sense.</p>
<p>The interesting thing about working with so many technology folks is how differently they tend to approach problem solving than most Marketing folks - that&#8217;s why I really like to have these ideas &#8220;spoken back to me&#8221; from the tech brain perspective.</p>
<p>The model is a Process - which I think is a way of understanding the world many tech folks can appreciate.  The Band model reflects a way of thinking about Marketing that&#8217;s different from the usual offline approach (Push) that many onliners mimic.  The more appropriate model for <strong>interactive relationships</strong> is that audiences are in &#8220;stages&#8221; and communicating to each stage uniquely (Pull) creates a truly optimized Marketing system.</p>
<p>In the Bands model, we take the Behavioral psych model AIDAS - Attention, Interest, Desire, Action, Satisfaction - and translate that into an Action plan.  The Top 2 Bands are addressing Attention, Interest, Desire.  Band 3 is Action.  Band 4 is Satisfaction, and to the extent there is a need for ongoing Satisfaction, you&#8217;re dealing with Bands 5 - 8.  Ultimately, the model is a progressive, proactive plan of Value Creation / Conservation for the business.</p>
<p>Not all biz models, as you pointed out, need to address all 8 Bands, though I think if you really tear the biz model apart from a Marketing perspective, you’ll find more need for the lower Bands than you think.</p>
<p>So, your biz model relies heavily on the &#8220;Distribution&#8221; Band 2 - the GP&#8217;s and Nurses.  That&#8217;s where you focus your Attention, Interest, Desire activities – the conference and partner web sites.  </p>
<p>I’d find it hard to believe nothing happens in Band 1 – no articles or mentions in medical trade magazines?  No professional chat board or social media references to the site?  And if not, then why not?  Given zero budget for general Attention, shouldn’t there be some kind of effort on the PR side to get these Attention vehicles moving for you?  </p>
<p>Band 3 is the Action taken by the Targets of Bands 1 and 2 – the web site referral to the end patient.  In this role, the GP or Nurse is actually the “Landing Page” for the end consumer, because Band 4 is the actual visit by the patient to the web site – the end payoff or conversion.  </p>
<p>What could you do from a Marketing perspective to influence, facilitate, or “optimize” the human Landing Page that is this medical professional?  Are there downloads or other props (pens?  magnets?  sticky pads?) that could be supplied to the professionals which would facilitate / solidify the handoff from the referral to the actual site visit?  </p>
<p>In other words, can the Navigation of this Human Landing Page be further Optimized for the end consumer?</p>
<p>The desired Satisfaction taking place in Band 4, as you point out, simply is what it is.  And assuming the content is what was expected, the Visitor enters Band 5 with Satisfaction, and hopefully a newsletter subscription as part of the Band 4 Action.  The newsletter, as you point out, is the primary Retention device and to the extent the customer never needs to return, the LifeCycle is over, you have Defection and final LifeTime Value.</p>
<p>Unless you run ads in the newsletter, of course&#8230;:O</p>
<p>Now, I’m not sure where the money is in your biz model, which is critical to understand in terms of activity for each Band.  But I’ll go out on a limb and suggest it’s a bit cavalier to at that point go with “we don’t really want people to hang around” and leave it at that.  </p>
<p>My first question would be, what happens to the Value you just created in that Visitor?  Because ultimately the whole Band model is about progressive Value Creation, so what happens to the value of the Satisfaction that has been created in Band 5?  Does it just vanish, like snuffing out a flame?  Or is there a notion that Satisfaction can be Conserved, that the positive Momentum created in the Visitor could be passed along to the next Band?  Is it too early to let that Satisfaction simply dissipate?</p>
<p>For example, isn’t there some kind of tell-a-friend or other take away the Consumer could engage in to pass their Band 5 Satisfaction to other people as a Band 6 Retention of the Value Created?  </p>
<p>Or can you facilitate passing this Satisfaction back to the medical professional in a Band 3 kind of activity, the office visit?  To a professional, who upon receiving this Satisfaction, would be more likely to recommend the site to yet even more patients in Band 3?  </p>
<p>Or, can this Satisfaction be Retained in a Band 1 activity, where in a social setting of some kind, the end consumer expresses this Satisfaction to an audience?  Could you drive this social activity through the newsletter, for example?</p>
<p>In terms of the model, the above would be a ReActivation or Re-Engagement.  The only difference is instead of the Satisfaction being Conserved in the same person, it is passed along and Conserved in a different person, audience, or media.  A Transfer.</p>
<p>This is why there are so many Bands down in the Satisfaction / Retention area of the model.  On first thought, perhaps it doesn’t seem like there is much to do down there for some business models.  But before rejecting these Bands as having no ability to create Value, I think one needs to think deeply about the Marketing implications of the Business Model for each Band, and then step through potential Band Scenarios.</p>
<p>Maybe you do all the things I mentioned above, but simply have not thought of them in the context of the Bands, so have not realized the potential power of putting resources against truly Optimizing them.  Or perhaps you have.</p>
<p>Either way, I hope that’s the kind of thinking this model will encourage!</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2008/06/06/online-marketing-bands/#comment-26583</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Jun 2008 10:51:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/?p=224#comment-26583</guid>
		<description>Arrgh. Sorry, meant: Bands 5+ aren't relevant! not 4+.
Cheers!
- Steve</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Arrgh. Sorry, meant: Bands 5+ aren&#8217;t relevant! not 4+.<br />
Cheers!<br />
- Steve</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2008/06/06/online-marketing-bands/#comment-26582</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Jun 2008 10:48:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/?p=224#comment-26582</guid>
		<description>I think I'm going to have to re-read this one. Yet Again. :-)

But a quick stab for the main site I look after. Consumer Health Information. Pretty much NO budget for any form of direct advertising. Do get some affiliate by targeting medical conferences (GPs, Nurses etc), as well as actual partner websites.

But IMHO we would change the bands you reference Jim.
In that Band 1 is non existent. And band's 2 &#38; 3 are equally (heh) engaged.
Depending on the affiliation (GP vs Partner Site) even more engaged than Site search. If you GP says check these pages at this site, you're far more heavily engaged than via a Google search.

And technically, I'd argue that bands 4+ aren't relevant. To us. In that we don't really want people to hang around - that implies we as a country aren't helping to improve peoples health! :-)
So the newsletter is a way of keeping in touch/reminding. But if people leave? They leave. And that's actually a good thing!

Make Sense? Thoughts? Discussion???

Cheers!
- Steve</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think I&#8217;m going to have to re-read this one. Yet Again. :-)</p>
<p>But a quick stab for the main site I look after. Consumer Health Information. Pretty much NO budget for any form of direct advertising. Do get some affiliate by targeting medical conferences (GPs, Nurses etc), as well as actual partner websites.</p>
<p>But IMHO we would change the bands you reference Jim.<br />
In that Band 1 is non existent. And band&#8217;s 2 &amp; 3 are equally (heh) engaged.<br />
Depending on the affiliation (GP vs Partner Site) even more engaged than Site search. If you GP says check these pages at this site, you&#8217;re far more heavily engaged than via a Google search.</p>
<p>And technically, I&#8217;d argue that bands 4+ aren&#8217;t relevant. To us. In that we don&#8217;t really want people to hang around - that implies we as a country aren&#8217;t helping to improve peoples health! :-)<br />
So the newsletter is a way of keeping in touch/reminding. But if people leave? They leave. And that&#8217;s actually a good thing!</p>
<p>Make Sense? Thoughts? Discussion???</p>
<p>Cheers!<br />
- Steve</p>
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