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	<title>Comments on: PRIZM Clusters Not as Predictive as Behavior</title>
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	<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/</link>
	<description>Moving from a Low Accountability to a High Accountability Business Model</description>
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		<title>By: Yooper</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/comment-page-1/#comment-21031</link>
		<dc:creator>Yooper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Apr 2008 17:44:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/#comment-21031</guid>
		<description>Yes, agreed.  As Prizm is  HH level model its really dependent on what data an internet marketer has at their disposal to use.  Any PII with address info can be matched to a Zip+6 level assignment, PII stripped and the segment then associated with the cookie for linkage.  The biggest issue is to your point; internet marketers using higher level geo append and applying to a HH.  Example is using IP to Zip appends which mostly append the ISP hub zip and then using this to append segments, demos, etc. based on that Zip.  This is a totally inaccruate way of targeting and misleading based on the IP to Zip append process.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, agreed.  As Prizm is  HH level model its really dependent on what data an internet marketer has at their disposal to use.  Any PII with address info can be matched to a Zip+6 level assignment, PII stripped and the segment then associated with the cookie for linkage.  The biggest issue is to your point; internet marketers using higher level geo append and applying to a HH.  Example is using IP to Zip appends which mostly append the ISP hub zip and then using this to append segments, demos, etc. based on that Zip.  This is a totally inaccruate way of targeting and misleading based on the IP to Zip append process.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Novo</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/comment-page-1/#comment-21030</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Novo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Apr 2008 16:33:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/#comment-21030</guid>
		<description>Yooper, Agreed.  As I said above:

&quot;Better than nothing?  Absolutely, and for customer acquisition, sometimes all you can get.  Best you can be?  Not if you have the behavioral records of customers.&quot;

What I&#039;m addressing here is the tendency of some Marketing folks to use PRIZM clusters in an inappropriate way, that is, to take a geographic profile (say zip-level) and apply it to a household.  

If you are marketing to the entire zip, this makes sense in terms of a model.  But if the classification was based on a geo-set and you are now marketing to a single household (a customer or two), the classification is bound to be off.

In other words, it matters where the cluster came from.  If it was created at the household level, then it will be accurate, and if that is useful, fine.  If the cluster was created at some level of geography and then applied to the houshold, chances are it won&#039;t be accurate.

Either way, if you have behavioral data, and behavior is what you seek, whatever model you are constructing should be based on this data before even considering PRIZM.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yooper, Agreed.  As I said above:</p>
<p>&#8220;Better than nothing?  Absolutely, and for customer acquisition, sometimes all you can get.  Best you can be?  Not if you have the behavioral records of customers.&#8221;</p>
<p>What I&#8217;m addressing here is the tendency of some Marketing folks to use PRIZM clusters in an inappropriate way, that is, to take a geographic profile (say zip-level) and apply it to a household.  </p>
<p>If you are marketing to the entire zip, this makes sense in terms of a model.  But if the classification was based on a geo-set and you are now marketing to a single household (a customer or two), the classification is bound to be off.</p>
<p>In other words, it matters where the cluster came from.  If it was created at the household level, then it will be accurate, and if that is useful, fine.  If the cluster was created at some level of geography and then applied to the houshold, chances are it won&#8217;t be accurate.</p>
<p>Either way, if you have behavioral data, and behavior is what you seek, whatever model you are constructing should be based on this data before even considering PRIZM.</p>
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		<title>By: Yooper</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/comment-page-1/#comment-21028</link>
		<dc:creator>Yooper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Apr 2008 15:59:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/#comment-21028</guid>
		<description>In the larger sense if you know that I’ve been to automotive sites that will be much more predictive that I’m in the market for a vehicle than the fact that I’m in a PRIZM segment that buys new vehicles, often.   However, what you may not know is what I may be most interested in new, used?  SUVs et al.   That is where PRIZM can enhance behavioral data.  Then again you may know I’ve been to Chevy looking at Silverados and that would be a pretty good predictor that I’m looking for a new truck.

 

PRIZM is not a replacement for actual behavior but sure is useful as another measure—even more so when you don’t know anything else or have some many behavioral items that you need some means to aggregate.  Think about it—what does someone do with thousands of click stream points?  How do brand managers align that with their overall marketing, branding “and promotion strategies?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the larger sense if you know that I’ve been to automotive sites that will be much more predictive that I’m in the market for a vehicle than the fact that I’m in a PRIZM segment that buys new vehicles, often.   However, what you may not know is what I may be most interested in new, used?  SUVs et al.   That is where PRIZM can enhance behavioral data.  Then again you may know I’ve been to Chevy looking at Silverados and that would be a pretty good predictor that I’m looking for a new truck.</p>
<p>PRIZM is not a replacement for actual behavior but sure is useful as another measure—even more so when you don’t know anything else or have some many behavioral items that you need some means to aggregate.  Think about it—what does someone do with thousands of click stream points?  How do brand managers align that with their overall marketing, branding “and promotion strategies?</p>
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		<title>By: Alex English</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/comment-page-1/#comment-20140</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex English</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Mar 2008 13:35:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/#comment-20140</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not sure if I disagree or not, but let&#039;s not be the ones to make a case on bad data.  Most PRIZM clusters are defined based on household level information not anonymous zip groupings.  There are several ways to match databases to PRIZM clusters and doing so at a zip level is ignorance on the part of the marketer.  You can identify down to the HH level what PRIZM cluster an individual belongs to.

Like I said, I&#039;m not sure I disagree - but at least we should get the facts right.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not sure if I disagree or not, but let&#8217;s not be the ones to make a case on bad data.  Most PRIZM clusters are defined based on household level information not anonymous zip groupings.  There are several ways to match databases to PRIZM clusters and doing so at a zip level is ignorance on the part of the marketer.  You can identify down to the HH level what PRIZM cluster an individual belongs to.</p>
<p>Like I said, I&#8217;m not sure I disagree &#8211; but at least we should get the facts right.</p>
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		<title>By: Nick Radcliffe</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/comment-page-1/#comment-6307</link>
		<dc:creator>Nick Radcliffe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Sep 2007 21:37:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/#comment-6307</guid>
		<description>Agree with that, too, Jim.   And ever reminded of the &quot;do what I say, not what I do&quot; mantra --- people, don&#039;t always do what they say they do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agree with that, too, Jim.   And ever reminded of the &#8220;do what I say, not what I do&#8221; mantra &#8212; people, don&#8217;t always do what they say they do.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Novo</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/comment-page-1/#comment-6210</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Novo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Sep 2007 11:51:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/#comment-6210</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the comment Nick.  It&#039;s a pretty simple idea (behavior predicts behavior better than demographics) but I think most marketing folks are so used to relying on demographics - often because they have nothing else - that it&#039;s just assumed the demos are drivers.  But what people do and &quot;who they are&quot; from a demo perspective can be widely divergent.

Demos can be useful to classify groups of folks when no behavioral data is present, as in many offline media buying situations.  But if the end goal is a behavior of some kind rather than an &quot;impression&quot; against a nameless, faceless demo, behavior is what you need to model. 

I would toss survey data (what they say) into the demo bucket as well as far as being predictive of behavior, but this post has already ruffled a lot of feathers.  Let&#039;s just say post survey tracking of &quot;what I said I would do&quot; versus &quot;what I actually did&quot; is critical.  I have seen enough inverse correlation between the two to be very wary of acting on survey data alone.  Part of the puzzle, not the answer, often the wrong answer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the comment Nick.  It&#8217;s a pretty simple idea (behavior predicts behavior better than demographics) but I think most marketing folks are so used to relying on demographics &#8211; often because they have nothing else &#8211; that it&#8217;s just assumed the demos are drivers.  But what people do and &#8220;who they are&#8221; from a demo perspective can be widely divergent.</p>
<p>Demos can be useful to classify groups of folks when no behavioral data is present, as in many offline media buying situations.  But if the end goal is a behavior of some kind rather than an &#8220;impression&#8221; against a nameless, faceless demo, behavior is what you need to model. </p>
<p>I would toss survey data (what they say) into the demo bucket as well as far as being predictive of behavior, but this post has already ruffled a lot of feathers.  Let&#8217;s just say post survey tracking of &#8220;what I said I would do&#8221; versus &#8220;what I actually did&#8221; is critical.  I have seen enough inverse correlation between the two to be very wary of acting on survey data alone.  Part of the puzzle, not the answer, often the wrong answer.</p>
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		<title>By: Nick Radcliffe</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/comment-page-1/#comment-6204</link>
		<dc:creator>Nick Radcliffe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Sep 2007 07:57:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/#comment-6204</guid>
		<description>Completely agree.

You can see it in the numbers too.   I find that it&#039;s rare to be able to build a model on non-behavioral data (even when it includes geocodings) that has a gini coefficient higher than about 40%, whereas models built on behavioral data frequently get gini values of 70-85%, especially in credit risk.

Our genes, our location and so on all tell part of the story --- maybe more than we&#039;d like --- but it remains the case that you get a much better understanding by looking at what people do, than at who they are.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Completely agree.</p>
<p>You can see it in the numbers too.   I find that it&#8217;s rare to be able to build a model on non-behavioral data (even when it includes geocodings) that has a gini coefficient higher than about 40%, whereas models built on behavioral data frequently get gini values of 70-85%, especially in credit risk.</p>
<p>Our genes, our location and so on all tell part of the story &#8212; maybe more than we&#8217;d like &#8212; but it remains the case that you get a much better understanding by looking at what people do, than at who they are.</p>
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		<title>By: PRIZM Clusters Not as Predictive as Behavior</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/comment-page-1/#comment-5687</link>
		<dc:creator>PRIZM Clusters Not as Predictive as Behavior</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Aug 2007 14:18:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/#comment-5687</guid>
		<description>[...] On his Marketing Productivity Blog, Jim Novo drills down into the misconception that PRIZM (define) clusters can be more predictive than actual human behavior. A rare breed of marketer who understands both the statistical and behavior ends of the spectrum, Jim explains the danger of distorting one&#039;s vision by gazing only through the PRIZM:  [&#8230;] what is the likelihood these households reflect the overall “label” of the PRIZM cluster? Combine this with the fact that for customer analysis, demographics are generally descriptive or suggestive but not nearly as predictive as behavior and you have a bit of a mess. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] On his Marketing Productivity Blog, Jim Novo drills down into the misconception that PRIZM (define) clusters can be more predictive than actual human behavior. A rare breed of marketer who understands both the statistical and behavior ends of the spectrum, Jim explains the danger of distorting one&#39;s vision by gazing only through the PRIZM:  [&#8230;] what is the likelihood these households reflect the overall “label” of the PRIZM cluster? Combine this with the fact that for customer analysis, demographics are generally descriptive or suggestive but not nearly as predictive as behavior and you have a bit of a mess. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Novo</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/comment-page-1/#comment-5641</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Novo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Aug 2007 12:11:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/#comment-5641</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the comments folks! I did get a couple of e-mail nastigrams from vendors of this type of service telling me how I was all wrong, but they missed the point, outlined well by the folks at Diamond and Suzanne.

I don&#039;t have anything against geo-demographics, they simply are what they are. But after they gained momentum in the early 90&#039;s there was an effort to sell them for every application as a &quot;magic bullet&quot; and they simply do not work well for certain applications. I know this idea is incredibly attractive to the many IT-centric marketers on the web, so thought I would provide some background.

I&#039;m still leary of using geo-dems as a &quot;match back&quot; to provide color for a customer database due to the fragmentation issue - the penetration of customer accounts in any one geographic location is usually so small the margin of error could be quite large. The &quot;&lt;a href=&quot;http://diamondinfoanalytics.com/blog1/2007/08/23/prizm-in-web-analytics/&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot;&gt;You will need to augment it with good market research&lt;/a&gt;&quot; comment by Diamond addresses this issue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the comments folks! I did get a couple of e-mail nastigrams from vendors of this type of service telling me how I was all wrong, but they missed the point, outlined well by the folks at Diamond and Suzanne.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t have anything against geo-demographics, they simply are what they are. But after they gained momentum in the early 90&#8217;s there was an effort to sell them for every application as a &#8220;magic bullet&#8221; and they simply do not work well for certain applications. I know this idea is incredibly attractive to the many IT-centric marketers on the web, so thought I would provide some background.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m still leary of using geo-dems as a &#8220;match back&#8221; to provide color for a customer database due to the fragmentation issue &#8211; the penetration of customer accounts in any one geographic location is usually so small the margin of error could be quite large. The &#8220;<a href="http://diamondinfoanalytics.com/blog1/2007/08/23/prizm-in-web-analytics/" target="_blank">You will need to augment it with good market research</a>&#8221; comment by Diamond addresses this issue.</p>
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		<title>By: Suzanne Obermire</title>
		<link>http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/comment-page-1/#comment-5555</link>
		<dc:creator>Suzanne Obermire</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Aug 2007 23:16:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.jimnovo.com/2007/08/22/prizm-clusters/#comment-5555</guid>
		<description>I completely agree with you that Prizm and/or any other neighborhood-based (demographic) system won&#039;t give you the information you need to fuel meaningful analysis.  As a long-time database marketer with very specific experience in understanding available data, I will say that in my experience Prizm and similar offerings are not used very widely anymore, especially if they&#039;re used alone (without complementing with other types of data). Demos alone definitely cannot predict an outcome, I believe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I completely agree with you that Prizm and/or any other neighborhood-based (demographic) system won&#8217;t give you the information you need to fuel meaningful analysis.  As a long-time database marketer with very specific experience in understanding available data, I will say that in my experience Prizm and similar offerings are not used very widely anymore, especially if they&#8217;re used alone (without complementing with other types of data). Demos alone definitely cannot predict an outcome, I believe.</p>
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